RaptorSource.com

 :rolleyes:

Let me start this by saying I have no clue what I'm doing with a 700, as most of you know I've been pretty dedicated to building my 660 Relic for the last few years, but decided it was finally time to let the Filthy Pig die. I love bacon.  ??? Looking to keep stock stroke and stock bore here...

Anyway, most of my riding has been duning.  8) Treeshots, trails and open duning are what I love, but I'm about 5 hours away from sand, so I've been looking to build something more trail friendly so I can ride more often and in my home state. Mostly I fart around in the dunes looking for a chance to dive into a nasty ass treeshot, but I like to line up at the hill from time to time as well when the opportunity presents itself. :nod: I'm not much of a jumper either, but I like to spend a bit of time off the ground hitting the back side of the smaller razor backs.

I don't need (or really even want) to be the fastest on the hill or in a flat drag, but I'd like to hold my own with a decent mild build. Mainly, I just need to be faster than my brother (08 SE w/ LTE's, Dobeck and MonsterFlow Intake)  :P or any punk kids showing up with their bolt-on YFZ's, you know the drill :lol: I don't want to lose trailability though, I want to be able to lug around the trails at a low speed if I want to, or hit them hard as well. (that last sentence has me thinking stay 100% stock :rofl:)  ::)

So that should give you an idea of what I'm looking for out of a build. Only really concerned with the engine at the moment, not worried about suspension as I've got most of what I need there, and (at least for a while) the rest will stay stock.

Obviously, I'll get a PC3/5, probably doing an FCI Intake, and a single exhaust. Prog. dyna as well will go on whatever build I do. The rest...  :confused: I dunno ?  :help:

Feel free to throw out any build you think is good that I haven't listed, or add anything you think the build would need/benifit from. (bigger TB for example, I have no clue where these come into play) Not really looking to spend a shitload, but I would be willing to spend around $1500 or so if it's worth it, though I'd ideally like to stay under $1000 (I know this limits my headwork). Poll has no time limit and you CAN change your vote. 

Why are you so set on that 5050 cam?

don't drink the kool-aid :)


x-2 ftw. 8)

Not set on the cam to be honest, just throwing one out there. Told ya I don't know jack shit about these ugly sons of bitches :lol:

j/k (sorta)

there's so many options out there. I'd say if you want to run trails, you should do something that's pump gas friendly. Plus its so nice just being able to pull up to a gas station and fill up.

I'd say 11:1 or 12.5:1 are your best options. Head Port. best bang for the buck is gonna be Bo hands down. Cam's I think is where you'll hear all sorts of opinions. I myself came from a Hot Cam stage 2. Loved it. Solid runner. But the gains in the x-2 were THAT much more.

I'd prefer pump gas, but since I'm not planning on a bore/stroke at all I'm not against upping the compression a bit to compensate and pay for 110. The more I think about it, the milder my build gets in my head...

Piston, cam, P&P ... but what goddamn combo !? Aaaaaaahhhhh... :run:

I've heard only mediocre reviews of the +2 head. So... for the $ I'd think it's a waste. especially for a medium based build.

I loved my hot cam stage 2. For the price, it was hard to beat.

I guess, I sorta gave you my opinion.

11:1 - Bo Track Port - Hot Cam stg2 or x2. :)

Dig it, thanks Randy ! :cheers:

voted for first option. pump gas or kiss my a$$! :lol: But get a hotcam stage 3 not 2. THat setup could be in the 60's with duals.  :thumbs:

MD likes low end and midrange, he likes the Stage 2 option ;)

I love my 11:1 wiseco with intake and fuel controller. I wouldnt mind a cam to top it off.

Hotcam 3....don't get that 5050 :no:

 :rofl: Damn, nobody thinks I should go fast eh ?  :batman:

You think I'll be missing the low end though if I go 11.5 w/ a stage 3 ? Bit of compression might help there, no ?

Quote from: PeelsSE2 on October 19, 2010, 03:12:18 PM
voted for first option. pump gas or kiss my a$$! :lol: But get a hotcam stage 3 not 2. THat setup could be in the 60's with duals.  :thumbs:

Duals, bah... single's already on it's way. Should support a decent build I hope, wouldn't expect it to limit me that much... You think ??? ?

New option listed at the bottom

id put the majority of the $$ into the head, id go RE +1 or +2 (personally id go +2), go with any cam thats not a hotcam, and a 14:1 piston.  You do not NEED to buy an expensive FCI intake, i run a prodesign on a more agressive build and it runs beautifuly. You have to keep in mind its gonna be another 100-200 for all of your gaskets, and another 20$ for stronger clutch springs, and a bit of machine work to get your cylinder to a true 14:1 compression.  I think the build i have listed above should be arround the 1500$ mark including a tune, i dont know what a RE head and a cam go for now adays  ???

Yeah, I was really planning on just a +1 head, just got so many people asking why not go +2 ? I didn't have a good answer LOL

Good call on the intake, I was pretty impressed with the MonsterFlow one I put on my bro's 700. Wonder what the differences on the same mild build w/ FCI vs. Monster or Prodesign ... I know there's a shootout thread somewhere... ???

a build that big a fci will really be noticable on gains. i would keep it pump gas with a 12:1 or 12.5:1 depending on what octane you can get. get a web4 over the 5050, dl seems to be the only one that can get a 5050 to make power but everyone else has good luck with the web4. the port job will make or break a ss/sb build so get the best you can afford. duals would make more power but a single can make power to. some of my friends run race gas and seems like they have to make plans to go ride and make sure they have fuel. i run pump gas so sometime i ride alone lol

i run a +2 re head and make good power. i really havent seen a comparison with a +1 to +2 so i got a +2 figuring i will probably go bigger than a stock bore

The RE + 1 CNC head flows a lot better than some +2 heads, so it's all in the port work too...

I really really liked my 105 bore, venom 14.1 piston, Bo's STOCK VALVE port, and x-2 cam!

EDIT: It just comes down to how much you wanna spend.

I just re-read your post and you looking to spend 1000-1500. Dont forget a bored TB.

Bo's head 250 (Best bang for the buck IMO)
high compression piston  250ish
x-2 cam 250ish
springs 200
big bore if you want is 250ish

make it unique Seggy, FERK the status quo!

I may be looking to get rid of my FCI, bored TB, and Exhaust here shortly...........FYI.

Quote from: Mad Dog on October 19, 2010, 03:13:01 PM
MD likes low end and midrange, he likes the Stage 2 option ;)

+1

Seg I LOVE my build with the Tech 11.5:1 piston, HDD5050 piston and Bo's T-Rex II porting with +1 valves. You can check out my dyno sheet in the dyno section of MR. It put out 66hp and 51 ft lbs of torque sucking air through just a K&N and adapter set up. I'm very happy with the 5050 cam. I have almost the same amount of torque (on the same dyno) as Geo does on his big bore build thats got about 10hp more than my build. Its got a pretty good power and torque curve...

http://www.moddedraptor.com/community/dyno-tuning/10243-latest-dyno-tune.html

Hey Steve, here's my suggestion and it follows some of the ideas already put forward.

Big 3
Intake - it's my understanding the FCI is good but really doesn't pay dividends till you have a larger CC, higher reving engine. Get a good adapter set-up that fits in the stock box (no lid) if you want to ride trails.

Exhaust - Not sure what single you got but any of the better flowing singles should be fine for a mild/medium build. Sparks, CT (you've run CT b4 on the 660 I believe) or the Rossier tested well on DL700's shoot-out.

Fuel Controller - That's an easy one, PC3 or PC5 with the AT.

Next step would be a cam/piston combo. If you want to remain pump gas then the TQS 11.5-1 piston is very nice. I currently have the HC2 and it has a very tractable, lugging bottom end. Race fuel - then the choice is yours, but I'd step up to the HC3 then. Either HC can be found for under $100 shipped and resold when you want to upgrade all day long for the same as you bought it.

Get a +3 TB next, followed by the ignition.

Once you're ready for headwork the $ jump gets bigger. I'd stay away from a +2 as they'll be shrouded in the stock bore. As mentioned above the RE +1 head is a very nice and proven piece. You'll need further head and rocker arm work to run bigger cams, so budget about $800 for the head, plus w/e cam you want.

It's dual exhaust time now unless you have a great flowing single.

FWIW, the set-up in my sig with the single put out 57 hp, 47 torque down at Kraz-E-Dealz in Winchester.

Quote from: SprinterX on October 19, 2010, 11:48:20 PM
Hey Steve, here's my suggestion and it follows some of the ideas already put forward.

Big 3
Intake - it's my understanding the FCI is good but really doesn't pay dividends till you have a larger CC, higher reving engine. Get a good adapter set-up that fits in the stock box (no lid) if you want to ride trails.

Exhaust - Not sure what single you got but any of the better flowing singles should be fine for a mild/medium build. Sparks, CT (you've run CT b4 on the 660 I believe) or the Rossier tested well on DL700's shoot-out.

Fuel Controller - That's an easy one, PC3 or PC5 with the AT.

Next step would be a cam/piston combo. If you want to remain pump gas then the TQS 11.5-1 piston is very nice. I currently have the HC2 and it has a very tractable, lugging bottom end. Race fuel - then the choice is yours, but I'd step up to the HC3 then. Either HC can be found for under $100 shipped and resold when you want to upgrade all day long for the same as you bought it.

Get a +3 TB next, followed by the ignition.

Once you're ready for headwork the $ jump gets bigger. I'd stay away from a +2 as they'll be shrouded in the stock bore. As mentioned above the RE +1 head is a very nice and proven piece. You'll need further head and rocker arm work to run bigger cams, so budget about $800 for the head, plus w/e cam you want.

It's dual exhaust time now unless you have a great flowing single.

FWIW, the set-up in my sig with the single put out 57 hp, 47 torque down at Kraz-E-Dealz in Winchester.

??? The set up in your sig???

Quote from: Buck on October 19, 2010, 11:51:43 PM
??? The set up in your sig???

Forgot I didn't have one over here, ha ha. Just added it. Steve nows my build a/w.

Did everyone get the good 5050 cam and me shorted with a 2525 ???

Quote from: Buck on October 19, 2010, 11:29:11 PM
Seg I LOVE my build with the Tech 11.5:1 piston, HDD5050 piston and Bo's T-Rex II porting with +1 valves. You can check out my dyno sheet in the dyno section of MR. It put out 66hp and 51 ft lbs of torque sucking air through just a K&N and adapter set up. I'm very happy with the 5050 cam. I have almost the same amount of torque (on the same dyno) as Geo does on his big bore build thats got about 10hp more than my build. Its got a pretty good power and torque curve...

http://www.moddedraptor.com/community/dyno-tuning/10243-latest-dyno-tune.html

funny, we have a similar build (except I have 105mm 10.75:1 piston) and the x-2 cam. I have +2 vs +3. And no Ignition.

http://bob2bob.com/images/LittleSahara2010/SDC12976.JPG


nice build buck. :thumbs:

Quote from: SegKast on October 19, 2010, 04:16:45 PM
Duals, bah... single's already on it's way. Should support a decent build I hope, wouldn't expect it to limit me that much... You think ??? ?

What single did you get Steve? Was it that Kenz custom one I got slagged on for asking questions?  :rofl:

Like I said above, once you get into a ported, big valve head with a more aggressive cam profile your single will start to become the limiting (restricting) factor in ultimate hp/t output.

On second thought. Leave it stock. So I don't have to listen to you whine when it breaks.


Kthxbai

:cheers: Awesome info everybody, seriously thanks big time. Definately got me thinkin now ???

Oh, it should be unique Aaron. I don't have it all planned out quite yet (obviously lol) but she won't be a clone, that's for sure. :thumbs:

Kirk, Yeah I have that Kenz pipe on it's way. I know it will limit me at some point, but I after talking to Ken I think it will be sufficient for what I want to do. Should flow at least as well as a Sparks pipe, and shouldn't be too far off from a set of duals. Might have to borrow my Bro's LTEs and do a little dyno comparison sometime just for shits and giggles...

DUDE ! When did you get rid of the Barkers Kirk ? Thought you had them on @ the Rally ? (I feel like we've had this conversation and my stoner ass is forgetting LOL)

My last build I was chasing HP, but honestly once I spent some time at 74hp I kinda realized how unnecessary it really was for how I ride :lol: Don't get me wrong- it was fun as shit, but without spending all day at the hill it just wasn't getting used to it's full potential. So this one, sure I'd like it to be strong, but going to stay away from building a hillshooter. This time I'ma chase a perfect curve, F*CK the HP :lol:

Damn there's a lot more options on these 700's than I'm used to :crazy: Really appreciate the input/advice from you guys. I'm like a STD in a strip club here - no idea where I'm going next :rofl:

If your not that worried about power than might aswell stick with a pump gas build and not go all out with high comp and high $$ gas, so that should weed out a few options. RE + 1, HD5050, and a tech 11.5 would be a nice pump gas build i bet, with a +3 TB and FCI.

Well, not THAT worried, but ain't tryin to lose everything at the hill either :lol:

Quote from: Spartan727 on October 20, 2010, 04:31:10 AM
Did everyone get the good 5050 cam and me shorted with a 2525 ???

Im very happy with the 5050 cam. Its a torquemonster
Like I said earlier, Im right there in torque numbers as Geo's build with a Web 4 but he's got 10 more hp than me with his bigger bore

Quote from: SegKast on October 20, 2010, 09:27:14 AM
DUDE ! When did you get rid of the Barkers Kirk ? Thought you had them on @ the Rally ? (I feel like we've had this conversation and my stoner ass is forgetting LOL)

Didn't, still have them. Their first ride was at the Rally as a matter of fact. Barkers are sexy, sound great and do put down the numbers, but for some crazy reason I'd like to try and make it all work with a single.

I have three pipes actually. Barkers, my hybrid GYTR header - Motoworks SR-4 silencer and the CT Racing megaphone/ST disc set-up. Put the CT on and waiting to ride test that. I have some ideas where I want to go but need more info to help decide.

:lol: Decisions decisions... Believe me Brother, I feel ya !!