I currently have
Pro design (K&N)
PCIII with barker map
Barker duals
Dynatek Ignition
Evac valve
I plan to have the +2 TB bore very soon.
With these mods... is a cam still worth it? I am thinking yes, especially for the price. I really value my torque and my low end power though which is something to consider. I dont get to ride dunes much anymore so its a lot of trail where pulling the lower gear is always nice (lugging through it instead of that mandatory downshift).
I am pretty much thinking HCII or HCIII. I was for sure set of HCIII as everyone was saying no point in the 2 when you can get the 3.
Is this ^ Point still valid with the Stock piston? I dont plan on opening her up yet... Somewhere down the line (probably next year at this time) I would do a piston, but it would be pump gas so 11:1.
I would like to do the cam soon, as we are going to the dyno and want the cam in there before I dyno it (otherwise I wont add it...as I dont want a canned tune with a cam in).
Thoughts????
YES.
It's TOTALLY worth it. For the power that you gain. You don't miss it on the low end I swear. That is a similar build that I have. (Just I'm bored to a 727)
But to take advantage of those barkers and dynatek you're best off getting a bigger cam for sure!
I would say absolutely YES... I have stock bore and piston.
I run....
Barker Duals,
Dynatek Fuel Controller,
Dynatek Ignition,
+2 TB,
Hotcam III,
GYTR intake,
The intake is what I will be changing. I went with it because my other bike has one and I wanted the ease of cleaning and swapping out. After the Dyno, it is going to be changed to a better flowing intake system after Kam (KBR) gets done with their R&D.
As long as you are running the ignition, I would add the cam.
Ok stage III here I come!
What kind of torque do you think I can make with this combo? I would sacrifice a few HP for a few Ft/Lbs any day!
It would be nice to be at like 55-60 with 50+ ft/lbs if thats possible (on the torque anyway).
TrxOutlawz Machine runs great.
I am having to put in a stroker crank in mine to go faster than him.
Well that and the fact my stock crank is toast. :(
Quote from: r00st on August 20, 2008, 03:08:10 PM
Ok stage III here I come!
What kind of torque do you think I can make with this combo? I would sacrifice a few HP for a few Ft/Lbs any day!
It would be nice to be at like 55-60 with 50+ ft/lbs if thats possible (on the torque anyway).
I ended up with 58 HP and 45 TQ on KBR's Dyno. That is where mine is with the GYTR intake ( that will be replaced). Stock piston. I understand you can up the TQ by using a higher compression piston in the stock bore if you dont want to spend the money for cylinder work. Good luck to you on your decisions..
Thanks for the input.
Ya I too was thinking about switching to the FCI with box when it comes out, but 300 is kinda spendy for an intake (when I already have one..).
If they can show me dyno's compared to trinity/proflow intakes and the gain is good I will switch before the dyno.
58/45 is a monster for bolt ons! My old DS was 70/60 give or take but it was also 500+ lbs... So with these mods I should be just as fast with the bike weighing over 100 pounds less.
I know you can get torque/power with the Hi comp but I just dont want to go that route (not that available in northern illinois...and I just HATE the idea of it!) I would be plenty happy with 55-60 hp and hopefully closer to 50 ft/lbs. I guess I can always dyno the way I am (well with the cam) and if im not happy with it I can do piston/ and new intake next year which should add good power. After all...If I do everything now, what fun is not adding mods? I dont want to go big bore for awhile either, so this should satisfy me (for a few days ;) )
Guys, on a stage III do you have to change out the valve springs? I think I read somewhere you do.
From what I've read here is that Roost wants to put a cam in without pulling his head at this time. I assume you can't install the springs without pulling the head.
?????????
With a stage 2 spring upgrades are not "required" but recommended. For the Stage 3 it is recommended that you upgrade springs as they aren't stif enough to allow the valves to close fully before hitting the upstroke again.
Quote from: Krandall on August 22, 2008, 11:59:47 AM
With a stage 2 spring upgrades are not "required" but recommended. For the Stage 3 it is recommended that you upgrade springs as they aren't stif enough to allow the valves to close fully before hitting the upstroke again.
As a blanket statement thats true, but not exactly.
Is it required, no, is it recommeded yes.
the FAQs on the hotcams site states that it's not required, but will be if you add an ignition controller (Dynatek).
I will be adding new springs to mine. Overkill maybe, but I'd rather play it safe.
Aaron
+1. I had new springs installed on mine w the HC Stage 2. Safety's sake.
I don't want my valves floatin here.
Good call guys....I feel it's always a good practice to install a good set of springs when upgrading the camshaft to insure you get maximum potential of a given combination, even if it's not a requirment. Just sound judgement that will pay off in the long run IMHO :thumbs:
Ok, so it's agreed the springs should be changed. Can the springs be changed without pulling the head?
I have heard of people pressurizing the cylinder to hold the valve in place while changing the springs, what do you guys think?
Trying to help Roost out and myself. I am not quite ready for a piston so I don't want to pull my head yet.
Quote from: rutcutter on August 22, 2008, 02:28:38 PM
Ok, so it's agreeded the springs should be changed. Can the springs be changed without pulling the head?
I have heard of people pressurizing the cylinder to hold the valve in place while changing the springs, what do you guys think?
Trying to help Roost out and myself. I am not quite ready for a piston so I don't want to pull my head yet.
I know it can be done on a predator, but never had the need to do it on a raptor.
Quote from: rutcutter on August 22, 2008, 02:28:38 PM
Ok, so it's agreed the springs should be changed. Can the springs be changed without pulling the head?
I have heard of people pressurizing the cylinder to hold the valve in place while changing the springs, what do you guys think?
Trying to help Roost out and myself. I am not quite ready for a piston so I don't want to pull my head yet.
I have looked at it to see if I could do it and none of the off the shelf valve retainer/spring compressing tools that I have seen, own or found would work on it. As I look at it, it would need to attach to a reinstalled rocker arm shaft after the rocker arm was removed or be held down by the head studs......and would be a pain in the ass. I was going to make a tool and said screw it and just pulled my head to remove my springs and check the seat and over the nose pressure in my valve spring tester. Someone like Kenny @ KDS could probably make a tool and sell it so the guys that are going to run his radical new cam when it comes out, can change out or re shim valve springs after a given number of races. Maybe he is already on it? Might give him a holler and see if he has come up with anything.
Randy
These work great. http://shoptoolsshoptools.com/shopexd.asp?id=2257 (http://shoptoolsshoptools.com/shopexd.asp?id=2257)
That looks great :thumbs: I have a question though, how do you compress the spring enough to get the keepers slid down below the retainer so when you release the pressure the keepers move up and seat in the in the valve stem keeper groove and the retainer? I have always needed the leverage of the fixed style of the on the engine type of spring compressors to get the retainer down enough to put the keepers in and get them seated correctly.
The springs in these things do not require a lot of force to compress.
You can even use a hammer to compress the springs and install them.
A magnet pulls out the locks.
Going back together there is a cone that keeps the locks in place. I have one and it works great.
So you have changed springs with the head on the engine and the cylinder filled with Air on your 700R ?
I've done it on lot's of automotive and race engines over the years, just haven't done it on my 700R yet.
I pulled the head the last time I checked my springs. I might have to get me one of those tools you posted the link to 8)
yes i did, when I put in the POS stage 2 Web Cam
Quote from: air on August 24, 2008, 09:38:50 PM
yes i did, when I put in the POS stage 2 Web Cam
Bummer about the Web cam.....cool you were able to change the springs without pulling the head :) Thanks for posting that link.....that will be very helpfull :thumbs: