My experience with RacersEdge.

[Gunz]

I don't know where to start so I'm just gonna lay it out there. I called John back in the last weeks of July and told him that I was going to do a ground up on my bike and that included fixing any problems with my motor. We discussed a few things about what I wanted and such and the time period it would take (2 weeks from the time he got it to the time it shipped). About the first week of August he received my motor, called me and we agreed on a R&D race cut trans, new clutch, bore out my 54tb to a true 54tb, new valves and springs, port match my head to a 54tb, bore a stock head to tb boot to fit the WK tb, he also wanted to send my Barker crank off to get balanced and new bearings if needed, replace the rings in the jug, he also wanted to take a little out of the left chamber of the head, which I believe he did. The object of this build was to build me a tank of a motor with all my parts or replaced parts with new. I had hoped to gain a few hp/tq with the TB and a few other things considering that my motor had hundreds and hundreds of hard use on it, but if I had the same numbers as it it did when it went in vs when it came out, I would've been cool with it.

So problem number 1, it took more like 6 weeks verses 2 weeks, OK I can handle that because most vendors tell you want you want to hear so they can get the job. I understand it, just don't approve of it, it's called bullshitting a customer.

Problem 2, when you ship a motor, chances are that crate is mad for one trip and done for. My motor came back to Preddy all beat to hell in the same shitty crate he used.  Again not to big a deal TRF did the same thing to me 3-4 years ago. What I don't understand is why would a vendor do that? Charge me if you have to but don't ship a $5000 motor back in something it's gonna fall out of. Can you imagine getting a 350 crated back to you in a something the UPS guy can roll up like a bouncy ball? Oooor what if a bought a sweet 69 VW and the shipper had the carrier load it on it's roof? Not cool.

Problem 3, The boot wasn't properly bored to match the tb/head. I'm not sure if John sent a new one or if Preddy had to fix it.

Problem 4, The o-rings for the oil lines were not sent with the motor.

Problem 5, I was sent back springs for 613 TRX build, verses my Ferrara springs.

Problem 6, The base gasket has a definite leak in the front of the motor. Thats just plan fuuked up!

Problem 7, major coolant leak. At first I thought it was a water pump, because of the fact we have had a few around here go out. I was kinda upset because I knew I had put a new one on before we sent the motor and it just sucked that I thought I was going to have to buy another.

Problem 8, Clutch.... Was not replaced. I haven't received a receipt yet so I don't know If I paid for it or not. When we put the bike on the dyno we got 2 pulls before it was totally trashed. Preddy mentioned to me that John told him I still needed a new one. However If you going through a motor and agreed to replace any part that is even slightly questionable, then you do it, especially when the clutch was questioned up front by the builder.

Problem 9, when changing out the clutch we found that the hose between the water pump and motor was only hand tightened, which lead us to believe that was the coolant leak. However after further investigation (thanks Pleasureburban) we found that the water pump didn't even have a ring gasket on it. Coolant leak was solved.

Problem 10, Found a couple of the tabs that hold nuts not bent over on the crank and balance gears.

This build cost me $2929.00 well under my budget. I have not recieved a receipt yet so I don't know how things panned out as far as prices. Before all the problems I was totally happy with the price and even if he he hit me with a $5000 invoice I still would have been happy. After the fact and seeing all the problems after the fact, Im still happy with what I spent however I'm totally beside myself on all the problems. The only problems I had when I handed Jason the motor at TRF  for $4000 was a shitty crating job, that was it.

When Preddy got this motor shipped to his house he was a little upset about the crating, the oil line o-rings, and the TB boot. So he was in the chat
room around 10pm later that night or the night after and was asked what he thought about RE, his retort was simple.. RE sucks. We'll there was about 3 people in there and 3-4 lurkers, one of those lurks felt like he had to be a bitch and run and get John on the horn about this. So a little bit goes by and John is calling Preddy cussing him up and down the block about slamming his reputation. In my opinion, Preddy was out of line on the remark. John was way outta line for calling somebody at 11pm at night and making it into a single sided cussing match. I to am a business owner with thousands and thousands of clients. I do take it personal if somebody attacks me, but that's business. You aren't gonna win them all and you sure as hell don't call them up and vent on them. Bad business John, you know it, I know it. Preddy was my employee during this, which means if you had a problem with him, bring it to me. (I do have all the history in chat on RS if we need to address it)


I had called John to see if I could have Preddy call him about what order he wanted the motor primed in. He told me he wouldn't talk to him and that rather just give me my money back and wash his hands of it. I told him I didn't need his money, but I did need for him to make sure I get this motor running properly and in the order of how he(john) wanted it started in. Needless to say after the phone call I was pretty pissed about how John acted about it and was unwilling to help. He did call me back about 5-10 minutes later and changed his attitude for the better and told me to have Preddy call him. I felt like John was trying to get over what Preddy had mentioned in the chat previously and moving on with it.

We finally got a clutch and the coolant resolved, enough to at least get the bike on the dyno and get it tuned. My numbers before Racers Edge got it were 87hp/62tq. The numbers after they had returned it back to me 84/59. Wrong direction but same ball park. I can't complain about it, but I want to really really bad. Lets just say I got my butt hurt over it a little bit. I was expecting the 87/62 and hoping for 90/63. It was dynoed in the same temp and humidity and was double checked with other bikes. So the numbers stick. I'm sure we could have gotten up to 90hp if I wanted to cheat the dyno, but I'm all about the A/F ratio and being a solid tune over bragging. I've got a big enough motor that it speaks for it's self on dyno numbers.

This bike was presented at the 3rd Little Sahara Rally. About 100 people had the chance to look this bike over. About 5-10 got to turn wrenches on it for various things. So I imagine there is going to be a few haters on here, just remember there was about 100 witnesses that I imagine will stop or chose to never do business with Racers Edge. Me being one. I believe in John and Racers Edge, but this was unacceptable.

My build

R&D race cut tranny
Hinson billet basket
slingshot lockout
OEM fibers
EBC steels
Barker 6 mill crank
106 cylinder
106 JE 12:1 piston
Originally was a Barker +2 valved head (tampered with by RE), can't claim it as a Barker head anymore.
kibble White +2 valves
Kibble White Springs
54 WK TB 54 through and though
WK big intake
PC3
Dynatek with KDS curve 2

84hp/59tq

I'm sure the numbers will raise up as the motor gets broke in.

[Peelz]

ouch. And I better NEVER get a 69 VW shipped on it's roof.

[Krandall]

It's really a bummer all this happened.. Especially to someone who is well known and vocal on all of the forums..  Gunny has damn near every mod possible on his quad and will give you his opinion straight up no sugar coating.
It will be interesting to see if the #'s go up. But I'd still think with a fresh motor even, you should be sitting higher than the previous build.

[Pleasuresburban]

Since I did turn some wrenches on this bike at the rally, I will post some facts. The bolts holding the slingshot lockout were stripped out also. We had to hammer a torx on there to remove and replace them with all new bolts. The keepers not folded over but maybe a edge on the corner was a concern for me. I found the base gasket leak before it was even ran at the dunes. Clutch steels were burned up, fibers looked ok but he still had to buy a entire clutch at the dunes and two clutch cover gaskets. Water pump was missing entire O ring which cost opening and buying a entire top end gasket kit. Let's not forget the 2 quarts of oil lost and engine ice. All this was obvious upon inspection and I'm a 660 guy. 

[Krandall]

You rock Pleasures.

[preddy08]

Gunny covered it pretty well, but I'd like to add my two cents.


I feel awful because gunny had to wrench on his bike during the rally. That is a direct reflection on me and the work I do. I planned on giving him a bike that's 100% ready to be beat on for years to come. I was not able to do this due to receiving the motor later than promised. I simply didn't have the time. I received the motor Sept, 15th. Dropped it in that night and left for vacation the next morning. We've known all along I was leaving town and if we had received the motor on time it would not of been a problem.

I got back from vacation and worked my ass off! Get off work, work on the bike till 1-2am, get up at 6am go to work and repeat. Weekends I would work all day and work till 3am+ in the morning. I've neglected my wife, friends family, for over a week to get it ready due to John BSing us on the motors due date. I was able to start the bike the night before the rally and ride it for the FIRST TIME! I was leaving for Oklahoma in less than 24 hours and I have 5 minutes of ride time. Suspension wasn't dialed in like I'd hoped, parts still needed hung. I flat out didn't have time to do what I wanted to do, and that makes me look bad. Me looking bad to over 100 people at the rally from something that was out of my hands is not cool.

[russ-russ]

I can't speak for everybody preddy, but I absolutely don't see the problems as a reflection of your work.  However, I did follow you build thread and knew the scheduling problems beforehand.  The lack of troubleshooting time on a comprehensive build like this is just naturally going to leave some unsolved issues.  The rest of the bike is flat-out amazing and that is the reflection of your work.

[Hefe]

+1
your work is stunning Predders!

[Firemann32]

+1
your work is stunning Predders!

Yep Yep!!!!!!!

[Peelz]

+1
your work is stunning Predders!

quote change necessary...but this is a serious thread.... 

That bike was flat out gorgeous. And I only saw it online.

[preddy08]

much obliged fellers! 

[Krandall]

all of the said issues were completely out of your control.. a whole motor coming back in one piece should be issue free.

[russ-russ]

all of the said issues were completely out of your control.. a whole motor coming back in one piece should be issue free.

+1

[Alkire193]

Sorry the numbers weren't what you wanted Gunny. Maybe this will be a wake up call for RE. I know they have done good work for people in the past. Maybe just need some more attention to the details in the future.

Couple of tweaks and you will get your numbers! She looks amazing

[Colorado700R]

Mike, I'm truly sorry you were disapointed with your motor. And I wish I was there to help when the issues atarted compiling.

Shawn, you did an amazing job with this build. And I know the LAST thing you wanted to see was any type of disapointment on Mike's face.  I wish i could have been closer to give you a hand when the time started counting down.

I know Mike is getting his motor issues handled, and I firmly believe we haven't seen the full potential of this build on the dyno yet either (fixing Leaking head/base gaskets/clutch + 10 hours of good hard break in should help it lean hard into the wind)


The build, and it's reveal at the rally was a big deal to him. Not finacially, but as something to look forward while pushing mind-numbing 80hrs a week for atleast the last 5 months (Probably more). The anticipation to ride and show off his new bike had to be huge....only to have issues, and disappointment.

My bottomline is that I'm not taking sides. I don't know enough about the whole story to make a judgement, and even if I did, I have no stake in the game. But I do feel for my friends. Both Mike and Shawn, and the others who feel divided by these threads.


So,

Mike.....you can impress anyone, even if you were rocking a rusty Vespa. Good people just shine.

Shawn...You are the man, any fool can see you put your soul into this bike.

John..I think i understand why your not engaging, becuase Mike isn't looking for any ammends to be made, so posting seems fruitless. But for the record, I do believe you never meant to disappoint anyone, ever.

Aaron