what you packin crazy white boy?

[Magz]

I used to be into owning a lot of guns once, then i realized my wenus was not soo small after all... and sold them all.
all i have left is a mosin nagant.. verry strong cheap ass gun. rounds are expesive too..... but i still like it.......   

[Peelz]

what's with all the vids of you and your buddies jumping off your quads and shooting things then? 

[Magz]

dammit peels... ssssssshhhhhhhhhhh.         blowing my cover buddy.......

[phucker]

ya i am thinking about the trijicon scope or a burris black diamond

[disco]

Probably go with eotech on my .22 m4 clone.  when I get something more target or hunting oriented I'll get a good quailty scope.   

read about how to do a poor mans trigger job on the Nagant and think I'll tackle that next week.  Basically shim or flatten a leaf spring to reduce weight then buff and polish a few surfaces.

[Sand84]

I just picked up this Lower.   Now does anybody have any input on a Complete .223 upper?  Not wanting to go higher than $600.   Im broke  

[Sand84]

I just found this is it decent?

M4 Chrome Lined Upper on Sale!!
Del-Ton, Inc. is offering a 16'' M4 1x7 Chrome Moly Vanadium (CMV) Chrome Lined Barrel Assembly with F-Marked Front Sight Base, M4 Feed Ramps and HPT & MPI Tested Bolt @ $395.00 each! Usually $460.00 each, so you save an awesome $65.00! This offer won't last long, so don't delay, order yours today!
AR-15 16'' DTI M4 CL 1x7 Barrel Assembly w/ F Marked Front Sight Base, Product Code: DT1028
Sale Price $395.00 each.
This Complete upper includes 16'' M4 CMV Chrome Lined 1x7 twist Barrel, F-Marked Front Sight Base, Flat Top Upper with M4 Feed Ramps, AR-15 Bolt and Carrier assembly - properly staked and sealed gas key - carpenter 158 HPT & MPI Tested Bolt, Charging Handle and CAR Handguard. These are head-spaced and test fired. Ready to drop onto a complete lower receiver.
Please remember these are built to order.

[disco]

going to post a quick reply, kinda tied up at the moment.  can't beat that price IMHO but that 1 in 7 barrel is a fast twist and you'll have a hard time with the 55 grain bullets from what I've read.  55 gr bullets are fast, add a fast twist barrel and I've heard of them coming apart downrange.  the 62+ grain bullets are longer slower and need the faster twist to stabilize.  1:9 is typical, 1:7 is a fast twist designed for longer and heavier bullets.  nothing wrong with it, I just wouldn't shoot 55 gr bullets with it. 

[Sand84]

Ok thanks for the info

[disco]

Would you buy a Kel Tec shotgun?  Click for pic, I linked it but it's huge so I took it out.

http://www.keltecweapons.com/news/preview-kel-tec-shotgun-ksg

The time for secrecy is nearing its end.  This SHOT Show, Kel-Tec will be revealing its next ground-breaking product: the KSG (Kel-Tec Shotgun).



The KSG is our first entry into the shotgun market.  The size, shape and design are similar to the currently available Kel-Tec RFB rifle, but the KSG ejects downward, instead of forward.  The KSG weighs 6.9lbs and is as compact as legally possible with a 26.1" overall length and an 18.5" cylinder bore barrel.  Even with this compact size, the internal dual tube magazines hold an impressive 14 rounds of 12 gage 2-3/4" rounds (7 per tube).  The simple and reliable pump action feeds from either the left or right tube.  The feed side is manually selected by a lever located behind the trigger guard.  The lever can be positioned in the center detent in order to easily clear the chamber without feeding another round from either magazine.  A cross bolt style safety blocks the sear, and the pump release lever is located in front of the trigger guard.



The pump includes an under Picatinny rail for the mounting of a forward grip, or a light or laser.  The included top Picatinny sight rail will accept many types of optics or iron sights.  Forward and rear sling loops are built in, and a basic sling is included.  The soft rubber butt pad helps to tame recoil.



MSRP has not been officially been set, but we are looking at the $800.00 range.

[phucker]

1in7 twist is what you want. it will stabilize 55gr just fine i think it will stabilize 45-80 grain projectiles. if you want to shoot long distance you want 1:7 and about a 68-75 grain bullet. if you go 1:9 it wont stabilize the heavier rounds out past150-200 yards. i am trying harder than hell to find a company to custom make a barrel for my para ordnance ttr. it doesnt use the standard ar15 barrel i guess the gas ports are in a different location.

as for that upper i would say it is good, my brother has a complete delton upper with a spikes tactical lower and it is a damn nice gun for the price. also you will want a bolt carrier group that is chromed, it doesnt allow fouling nearly as fast and lasts a  lot longer.

[phucker]

@disco

i not a fan of keltec, just dont like the feel of them. if i had my choice for a shotgun it would be a benelli m4

[disco]

Disclaimer:  I'm proofing this and it's reading to me like I'm trying to be an internet db arguing.  Not my intent.


It's not a problem of stabilizing the lighter grain stuff, I've read the lighter and thinner jacketed bullets simply come apart.  This really isn't an issue with military stuff.  Maybe it's a hit or miss issue.  Find out what doesn't work and avoid it maybe? 

A definite positive like you say is the ability to shoot heavier projectiles accurately.  My 1:9 will digest anything I feed it but the longer the bullet is, the closer my target needs to be before my shot goes wandering off somewhere. 

At any rate, I'd buy that upper.  Just find the ammo it wants and run with it.  The heavier projectile carries more energy further downrange so there is no negative to shooting it.  I believe the longer M4 ramps were designed to help feed the longer ammo more reliably so you'll be able to feed it anything. 

I've got a lower I'm s-l-o-w-l-y putting together.  I'm going to run a 22-24" stainless barrel but haven't settled on a bullet and twist yet.  I'm going to put a heavy bullet in it and crank up the twist though.  Long barrels aren't too popular in ARs but it's going to sit on a bench.  I don't care if it weighs 100 pounds.     The extra few inches are supposed to be good for maybe another 200 fps which should help keep the bullet supersonic longer.  From what read so far, when the bullet drops to subsonic the shockwave will upset it slightly so accuracy suffers at that point.  I'm going to put a telescope with crosshairs on it.   


Random Google Search Dood #1

Military bullets are more forgiving with varying twist rates, so one could get by with 1/9, or 1/7 on most available military ammo.

Lighter weight civilian (commercial) bullets can work on a 1/7, but this is very dependent on jacket thickness. If the jacket is thin the bullet will probably disentegrate shortly after it leaves the barrel. I shoot both 50, and 52 grain varmit bullets out of my 1/9, and I get occasional disintegration even with this twist, so a faster twist in this case just wouldn't work. 40 grain bullets don't work at all in my barrel.   I just as well throw rocks at the target.  [Disco:  although I've read of guys that CAN shoot 40 gr just fine]

I think some barrels just prefer some bullets over others.

All this is just my opinion from field tests, which are far from scientific in my case. 

and Random Google Search Dood #2

Special purpose rifles often have uncommon twist rates. For example, if you are building a varmint rifle and want to shoot the short 35 grain, 40 grain, and 50 grain bullets, a 1:12, or even 1:14 twist would be best. On the other hand, long range High Power shooters often select 1:8, 1:7.7, 1:7, or 1:6.5-twist barrels to stabilize the long 77, 80 and even 90 grain bullets used for 1,000 yard competition. Additionally, new testing of heavier rounds (68-77 grains) seems to show that they perform very well in simulated tissue and may be a better defensive choice than 55 grain or 62 grain rounds. The majority of shooters, though, typically shoot bullets of 50 to 69 grains in weight (note that the 62gr SS-109/M855 bullet is as long as a 71 grain lead core bullet) and should select 1:9 twist barrels. At typical .223 velocities, a 1:9 twist will stabilize bullet lengths equivalent to lead-core bullets of 40 to 73 grains in weight.

1:12 twist rifles cannot stabilize SS-109/M855 bullets and 1:7 twist rifles are slightly less accurate with lighter bullets and will often blow apart the thin jackets of lightweight varmint bullets. The 1:7 twist is used by the military to stabilize the super-long L-110/M856 tracer bullet out to 800 yards, but unless your plans include shooting a significant amount of M856, the 1:9 twist rate is better suited for general use.

There is, of course, an exception: if you want to use loads utilizing the heavier, 75-77 grain match bullets currently used by Spec-Ops troops and other selected shooters, you'll want a 1:7 twist barrel. Although military loadings using these bullets are expensive and hard to get, some persistent folks have managed to obtain a supply, and will need the proper barrel twist to use them. Anyone who foresees a need to shoot this ammo should consider a 1:7 twist barrel

Now to whore it up a little bit, after I win the lottery and send Mikey a million dollar check for Raptor Rally III and we cruise our Raptors and RZRs, we're going to have to set up a shooting range too.     

Guns and accahol, baby!!!  Ooh, and the infamous Sobe special.

[phucker]

hmmm everything i have heard is that just the light loads have trouble in the 1:7. then again i am just going off what i have read. also dont buy Israeli bulk ammo, its dirty inaccurate and once i shoot about 100 rounds my gun fowls up.

so far the only ammo that shoots halfway accurate out of my gun is the 55 gr hornady tap and the reloads my brother makes with hornady vmax. the israeli and winchester and ae tracer rounds and remington shells in varying grains all shoot about a 4-6" group at 100 yards in my 1:9 twist barrel, the tap and vmax shoot about 1-1.5" at 100 all groups would be tighter is i had a higher power scope.

[russ-russ]

I just found this is it decent?

M4 Chrome Lined Upper on Sale!!
Del-Ton, Inc. is offering a 16'' M4 1x7 Chrome Moly Vanadium (CMV) Chrome Lined Barrel Assembly with F-Marked Front Sight Base, M4 Feed Ramps and HPT & MPI Tested Bolt @ $395.00 each! Usually $460.00 each, so you save an awesome $65.00! This offer won't last long, so don't delay, order yours today!
AR-15 16'' DTI M4 CL 1x7 Barrel Assembly w/ F Marked Front Sight Base, Product Code: DT1028
Sale Price $395.00 each.
This Complete upper includes 16'' M4 CMV Chrome Lined 1x7 twist Barrel, F-Marked Front Sight Base, Flat Top Upper with M4 Feed Ramps, AR-15 Bolt and Carrier assembly - properly staked and sealed gas key - carpenter 158 HPT & MPI Tested Bolt, Charging Handle and CAR Handguard. These are head-spaced and test fired. Ready to drop onto a complete lower receiver.
Please remember these are built to order.

Sand, what do you want your AR to do for you?  That will decide what upper you want.  The M4 style you listed would be just fine for general plinking and fun shooting.